DeLorean Mailing List - 6/14/97
dmcnews-digest Saturday, June 14 1997 Volume 02 : Number 252
In this issue:
DML: Jim Senft, air conditioning problem
DML: Another stupid turbo question
Re: DML: Windshield Replacement Advice?
Re: DML: Belfast//Auto Trans Trouble
Re: DML: Another stupid turbo question
DML: Re: Really Sad Story! AND BTTF VIN
DML: Re: NJ Cruise Night
DML: re: [2] A/C Costs
DML: Re: BTTF & WRECKED VINs
DML: Easy to replace shocks/struts?
DML: Re: DeLoreans in museums
DML: Mike Pack/Matt Peak & the web as a gossip forum
DML: Freon charge
DML: Turbo Questions?
DML: DMC For Sale
Re: DML: Re: DeLoreans in museums...North carolina
Re: DML: Re: NJ
Cruise Night
DML: Turbos
Re: DML: RE: Engine Fans Update
DML: Re: Inside rearview mirror replacement
Re: DML: Windshield
Replacement Advice?
DML: web page update
Re: DML: Windshield Replacement Advice?
DML: Valve covers.
Re: DML: Turbos
DML: Phillip's fan failure continues . . .
DML: Re: Temp Sensor Location
DML: Tires
DML: Re: Engine Fan Cooling Update
Re: DML: Valve covers.
DML: Another sad DeLorean in trouble story.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 16:15:03 -0500 (CDT) From: delorea1@ix.netcom.com
(MICHAEL K. CAROLLO) Subject: DML: Jim Senft, air conditioning problem
There are two items to look at when diagnosing this problem:
1. If you have updated your relays, then you need to make sure that you have
replaced the two circut breakers that are included with the kit with the
current flowing in the same direction as the older breakers have. The wires
from each side of these breakers is not interchangable. If you have mixed up
the wire connections, then the breakers become overheated and will cycle the
cooling fans because they are overheated. A good clue that you have this
problem is to check and make sure your fans cycle as they should when your
engine temperature is calling for the fans to cycle on and cool the radiator. If
you are not having a problem overheating when you run the air than this
probably is not your problem.
2. There is a low pressure switch located on the passenger side of the car,
mounted on the dryer assembly of the air conditioning. If you turn your front
wheels all the way to the left you will be able to access this switch without
jacking the car up. Behind the left front wheel is the dryer/switch assembly.
There is a three prong plug that is attached to this switch. Pull it off and
underneath is a fitting that can be moved with a pair of needle nose pliers
either clockwise or counterclockwise. This switch controls the cycling of the
air conditioning compressor based on the low side pressure of the air
conditioning. Start rotating the switch in slight increments until your cycling
starts to extend to what is recommended in the Delorean manual. My manual
indicates that the cycling time should be between 45 and 90 seconds. This time
will be dependant on ambiant outside temperature and humidity at the time
you are trying to adjust this switch. If by adjusting this switch you cannot
adjust the cycling time you should consider replacing this switch. It is very
inexpensive, 12 to 24 dollars and since this is a Harrison system, many GM
autos of the Delorean vintage use the same switch.
If you have any further questions feel free to call me at 708-672-5439 direct or
fax me at 708-672-5408.
Sincerely,
Mike
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 97 15:22:00 PDT
From: Knut S Grimsrud Subject:
DML: Another stupid turbo question
I'm not sure I had my previous question regarding the role of rotor
modification (as opposed to normal cap adjustment) in controlling ignition
advance on turbo equipped DMCs answered, but I will move on to the next
question to illustrate my ignorance.
On a turbo equipped DMC, how do the various vacuum operated controls
(such as the mode control switch that controls the various vacuum-driven
baffle actuators in the heater console) operate? Where do they get their
vacuum from?
Knut Grimsrud
DeLorean Club of Oregon
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1986 21:46:03 -0700
From: Lee Seiler
Subject: Re: DML: Windshield Replacement Advice?
At 04:43 PM 6/11/97 -0400, you wrote:
>OK everyone, I hope someone has dealt with this before and can offer
suggestions. As many of you may remember, a rock chipped my windshield
last year and I travelled to KAPAC to buy a replacement NOS windshield.
>I have not had any luck finding any area glass companies that are willing to
install the new windshield and accept responsibility if it should crack by
chance when they install it. My original windshield now has two long
vertical cracks in it and must be replaced before I renew the license plates
(DMC-12) next month. I am seriously considering pulling the old glass and
installing the NOS part myself, but I need some guidance in order to do so.
>Has anyone attempted the same thing before? And if so, can you offer an
opinion or advice on me doing it myself? Also, is the DMC windshield sealed
with a rubber strip or urethane sealant?
>Thanks!
>Chase Clark
>'81 DMC-12
>VIN#1529
Hi Chase,
Boy you are in for some interesting efforts. If you are any where in or near
California, I recommend that you contact me direct by phone or e-mail. I just
had a perfectly good windshield replaced because it had a road chip and
was not OMP from Delorean. THe installed windshield can not be removed
with
out breaking it. Yes it is held in place with Silicone rubber. The plastic frame
you see is only for show, it plays no part in holding the winshield in
place. The shop that did mine was the official Delorean body shop for "Glass"
when the cars were new and still do most of the replacements and body work
in my area. The work I have seen them do is quite amazing. The new
DMC Original part windshield just installed in my DMC is perfect, pased the
pressure leak test with no hint of leakage.
Hope I can be of help!
Lee
VIN# 5927
lee@ccnet.com
Tel: (510) 649-9118 Fax: (510) 848-7613
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1986 21:25:14 -0700
From: Lee Seiler
Subject: Re: DML: Belfast//Auto Trans Trouble
At 01:47 AM 6/11/97 -0400, you wrote:
>Hello all
>I must say that I had the best trip of my life in Belfast Northern Ireland. As
Jim, Scott, Chris, and I walked around the plant Jim said "You can almost feel
it." The production lines where the body trim and chassie trim lines were, are
covered over with cement. Some owners scraped off the epoxy from the floor.
We even found the executive offices, and DeLorean cinema which are in
poor condition.
>I hate to say this, and I shouldn't but a very close friend of JZD at the
Eurofest said that he has prostate cancer, and is sick. Lets wish him good
health. He did look good in the interview.
>My automatic has some problems. I replaced the gover. computer, filter, and
gaskets. put 3 1/2 quarts of fluid in and the car will not move. It ran fine
before except for the slippage with bad gov. computer but will not
>move. I inspected the selector lever arm, and cleaned the shift solonoids. No
reverse, or forward in any gear. Could it be the pump, or the vacume
modulator? There were no signs of metal in the pan.
>IN ADDITION, I WOULD LIKE TO ADD TO THE RECENT TALK OF
DELOREAN ONE. I CALLED ED BERSTEIN AND HE DID NOT WANT TO
SPEAK WITH ME. I THINK THAT ED HAS ME CONFUSED WITH
ANOTHER PERSON WITH THE SAME INITIALS OR SIMILAR E-MAIL
ADDRESS. ED SAID THAT HE HAS READ MY POSTINGS ABOUT
DELOREAN ONE. IF ANYONE OUT THERE HAS A POSTING FROM ME
ABOUT DELOREAN ONE PLEASE MAIL A COPY OF IT TO ME. I'M SURE
THAT I HAVE NEVER SAID ANYTHING BAD ABOUT A DELOREAN
SERVICE FACILITY, DMC GARDENGROVE, PJ GRADY, DMC HUSTON OR
D1.
>ED YOU SAID THAT YOU HAVE SEEN MY POSTINGS. WHEN AND
WHERE DID YOU SEE MY POSTINGS ABOUT YOUR SERVICE FACILITY?
>Sincerely
>Michael Pack
>410-551-3107
HI All,
I don't mean to interrupt you Michael, But as long as you have a post about
D-1 I would like to interject a comment please.
I have been grooming my own DMC for the past four months, as I have
decided to drive it every day, and it has been sitting so very long. As a result I
have been going threw my DMC most critical part to less critical, to do this I
have been combing all the US sources for DMC parts, manuals, information
etc. I have of course had several long conversations with ED, and think it's
worth while to comment about my assesment bearing on several
comments from several in this group about D-1. First the supposed future
value is a good starting point: I was discussing DMC value with Ed and on
more than one occasion he repeated what has been posted here as being
attributed to him with this exception: Ed said "My prices for Nwe DMCs" will
be ........ Now Ed quoting his New DMC price as a prediction for setting a
future value for DMCs is quite different than some of the comments here. I
also discussed his well known opinion about doing it right or not doing it at
all. This touches on your problem in some respects. My dad was like that
and so have been some of my past business associates, It took me a while to
understand how this kind of attitude effects one's business and success. I am
very much like this my self with an exception, It goes like this, once I
have made a value judgment I stick with that view unless I am compleetly
sure that that judgement is in question, but once I do realize this I change
my view, hopefully in the right direction. Ed has told me he doesn't want to
deal with customers who insist in, (in his view) are going to attempt a repair
that is doomed to fail. He has placed me in that position just this last week.
My responce was, OK you are sure!...yes I am...OK then if it is the problem or
fails youb will give me the replacement part Free?...er well
that unit almost never fails!...you said it "NEVER FAILS" so which is it? Well
I will sell you one but I don't really feel it is the problem!. So I did not buy the
addidional speedo unit, and ordered only the recommendede parts Ed
recommended. Ed also sent at no cost several pages describing trouble
shooting another problem I think might need attention. So I think that
instead of getting in to a personality conflict with Ed, maby deciding
if his services and desire to provide the best possible service is not so bad. We
all have the option to pay his preimum prices, and if we feel for what ever
reason he is not the source of choice, don't bother with him. Just
to be fair I will mention That I paid a preimum price for a new louver. It
arrived at the body shop damaged, Ed had insured and the unit was very well
packaged. So Now I have to deal with the shipping company, the body shop
and
Ed on my $708.00 louver. I will keep the list posted as to the out come,
ultimately the replacement falls on Ed if the Insurance company and fright
company claim the unit was damaged before shipment. OK ....thats it, I hope
this post may be useful in some small way.
Lee
VIN# 5927
lee@ccnet.com
Tel: (510) 649-9118 Fax: (510) 848-7613
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Jun 1997 03:51:55 -0400 (EDT) From: Behrens427@aol.com
Subject: Re: DML: Another stupid turbo question
I had no idea you could get a DeLorean that was turbocharged. Was this
aftermarket??
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Jun 1997 08:53:45 -0400
From: "Marc Levy" Subject: DML: Re: Really
Sad Story! AND BTTF VIN
One of 2 prototypes? Was one missing?? or is this a third?
Why did the guy not want to sell? Did you get any history on the car from
him? Any reason why he just lets it rot there? Even if this is not a "special"
Delorean, it is still a shame to let it rot there.
Pictures would be of interest, so if you get out there again, snap some shots.
Why not copy down the VIN as well?
Speaking of VIN's, do any of our BTTF fan members have the VIN's on the
cars used or destroyed while making the movies? James could add that
information to his list.
I know when I was at universal studios in Calif last year I saw a BTTF DMC
parked behind a building in the theme park. I am guessing it is used for drive
through with a Doc Brown actor. I missed that, but did see the blues
brothers in their car. I assume it is used for the same purpose. There was also
a DMC with the front nose removed that was being used in the special effects
show right across from ET adventure. That frame should also have a VIN in
it, it looks like it used to be a real DMC. If you volunteer (your kids, they like
to use kids) to sit in the car for the demonstration, you could look at the plate
in the door (assuming it is still there). So, if anyone visits try and get the
VIN'S!
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Jun 1997 08:59:27 -0400
From: "Marc Levy" Subject: DML: Re: NJ Cruise
Night
I think I will pass on the Balloon fair.. I hate crowds!
I have verified with Freehold Ford (major sponsor of cruise night) that the
last thursday of every month this summer will be Cruise Night in downtown
freehold.
As of now, I plan on attending June 26. We can all just show up and look for
eachother's cars, or we could plan ahead and all drive in together (really turn
some heads!).
Also, for reference to everyone (even outside of NJ), many of us only
subscribe to the digest, so it is best to give at least a week notice on theese types
of events!
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Jun 97 08:48:01 -0600
From: David Swingle Subject: DML: re: [2] A/C
Costs
Bill Marcussen wrote in reply to me:
>When I lived in the Chicago area (western suburbs) the best A/C recharge
value I found was at Jiffy Lube. Some of their stores offered service and
recharge, including up to 1 lb of Freon for about $80.00. This was a couple of
years ago, so their price might be higher today, but it's probably worth a phone
call. As I recall, not all of their shops offered this service, but I used to use
their location on Roosevelt Rd in Lombard. They were always competent and
courteous, including not charging me for the service one time when the
system needed to be repaired (they didn't offer repair service).
I called the the Jiffy Lube in town today. Their current price is $119 flat rate
(i.e. no incremental Freon cost) but THIS WEEK ONLY they are offering a $30-
off sale at $89. With tax it was $93.50. imagine - a sale on R12! The tech pulled
a vacuum, and stated that it held vacuum as good as any car he'd tested.
By the way, Jameel - you must have another problem. This unit puts out air
colder than my Acura (R12 vs R134), and plenty of it through all the vents.
Thanks for the info!
------------------------------
Date: 6/10/97 9:30 AM
From: Don Gowler-CFPO01@world.std.com, Don_Gowler-
CFPO01@email.mot.com Subject: DML: Re: BTTF & WRECKED VINs
Message authorized by:
: marc.levy@prudential.com@INTERNET at #EMAIL
>Someone wrote:
>SNIP >Speaking of VIN's, do any of our BTTF fan members have the VIN's
on the cars used or destroyed while making the movies? James could add that
information to his list.
I know there are a number of guys out their that have purchased old cars to
'part' them out (Bryan). Can we get you guys to add these VIN's to James'
list?
Regards, The Silver Fox
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Jun 1997 10:11:35 -0400 (EDT) From: Starman
Subject: DML: Easy to replace shocks/struts?
Hi all,
I'm looking to get my shocks and struts replaced. Should this be something
that local places can do? I really don't wnt to bother Rob in LI for a simple job
like this; I'd rather go up there for more important things. Can anyone
(epsicially in NJ) tell me if they've had good experiences with local places or
chains working on their suspension? Thanks.
Mike
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Jun 1997 08:25:21 -0400
From: Mike Substelny Subject: DML: Re:
DeLoreans in museums
James asked:
>At one time or another there was discussion of DeLoreans in museums. I
know of a few, but does anyone know of a book or direcotry of museums
Below is a partial reprint of a posting I made on the subject back in
November:
According to the book "American Automobile Collections and Museums" by
Michael Morlan (1992, Bon A Tirer Publishing, Shawnee Ks) the following
museums had DeLoreans as of 1992:
Museum City, State
International Motorsports Hall of Fame Talladega, Alabama Behring Auto
Museum Danville, California
SanDiego Automotive Museum* SanDiego, California
Wheels O' Time Museum Peoria, Illinois
Auburn-Cord-Deusenberg Museum Auburn, Indiana
Domino's Classic Car Collection Ann Arbor, Michigan
Gilmore Classic Car Club Museum Hickory Corners, Mich
Autos of Yesteryear** Rolla, Missouri
National Automobile Museum Reno, Nevada
Backing Up Classics Harrisburg, N.Carolina
Crawford Auto/Aviation Museum*** Cleveland, Ohio
Gast Classic Motorcars Exhibit Strasburg, Pa
Car Collectors Hall of Fame Nashville, Tennessee
* book indicates this museum has a 1977 DeLorean ** book indicates this
museum has a 1984 DeLorean *** has VIN#500 DeLorean displayed beside
stainless 1936
Ford and a stainless Lincoln Continental
I assume the 1977 and 1984 DeLoreans are typographical or clerical errors, but I
have not actually visited these museums to see for sure. The DeLorean at the
Crawford is always on display, but the ones at the Auburn-Cord-Deusenberg
and Gilmore were not displayed when I visited both in 1995.
According to the book most of the museum cars are 1981 models, although a
few are 1982s. This list is based solely on the book. I know for a fact that other
museums have DeLoreans now (The Peterson and Charlie Sens' off the top of
my head).
- -Mike Substelny
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Jun 1997 08:58:25 -0400
From: Mike Substelny Subject: DML: Mike
Pack/Matt Peak & the web as a gossip forum
James said:
>Before I resigned from the DOA board, I had contact with Ed on a regular
basis and he would often comment on things that he had read on the DML.
At the time, I knew that he had no internet access and he made it sound like
he had neither the time nor the inclination to get online. I asked him how he
knew these things and it came out that other list members faxed him copies
of things of interest.
Then, as far as relations with Ed go, we are all at the mercy of these unnamed
list members. Unless Ed becomes a subscriber, god knows what words will be
attributed to us!
These unnamed list members might fabricate anything depending on their
agenda. But even if they don't edit the messages we can still be victims of
what they consider "things of interest." For example, today I might post that I
had a great experience solving a tough problem with DeLorean One, but the
unnamed list members may think that's too boring to pass on. If tomorrow I
complain that DeLorean One hung up on me because I misread the seventh
digit of my VIN the unnamed list members might think that was juicy gossip
and fire up their fax machine. Thus, even if they are sincere, they can
manipulate Ed without meaning to.
If anyone is going to make judgements based on what is said on the DML they
really should become a subscriber.
- - Mike Substelny
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Jun 97 07:18:05 -0000
From: James Espey
Subject: DML: Freon charge
With all the talk of AC as of late, thought I'd pass on some info aboutthe
DeLoreans Freon charge requirements. The Service manual calls for 2.75
pounds of Freon, but a subsequent service bulletin amends that 2.2 pounds.
James
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Jun 1997 08:23:02 +0000
From: ausmith@pdx.oneworld.com
Subject: DML: Turbo Questions?
Hi Knut,
O.K. I'll try to answer your questions, but treat them as "best guess".
Installing the twin turbo system seperates the intake system into three distinct
parts. The half "doughnuts" that join the air cleaner, injection, vacuum,
center part of the intake, to the two square "rails" that carry the air to the
valves are removed, part #102279 at Sec.1, Sub. Sec.4, Group 1. The turbo
intake is joined to the center portion, part #102771 with all the other stuff,
and the pressure side of the turbos are connected to the "rails", part #102260.
The effect of all this is that the turbos draw their air through the air cleaner.
In non-boost all vacuum operations are as stock. When under boost vacuum
is actually increased by the draw of the turbos. That's why the distributor has
to be re-curved for turbo equipped engines. I imagine the increase wouldn't
effect the mode switch on the console much. When under boost I've never
tried to change the setting (grin). It would probably work quicker.
Chris
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Jun 1997 13:21:22 -0400
From: Kevin MacDougall Subject: DML: DMC For Sale
hi all just passing along an ad from my local paper.
82 DELOREAN GULL WING SPORTS CAR, air, 5 speed, 55,000 miles, grey
leather interior, excellent condition,
many extras, must sell, $12,750 negotiable. (203) 831-9861 Norwalk CT.
\|||/
(o o)
- -----------------------------ooO-(_)-Ooo---------------------------------
Kevin MacDougall
1964 VW Bug Conv.
Kevinmac@tiac.net http://www.tiac.net/users/kevinmac
************************************************************************
*
"If you're going to build a time machine out of a car, why not do it with some
style?" (Doc Brown)
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Jun 1997 17:53:51 -0400 (EDT) From: MICHAEL BABB
Subject: Re: DML: Re: DeLoreans in museums...North carolina
I will try to get down to the museum in NC and aquire a vin number for the
list....If I can find the place!
Michael Babb, MCSE
Microsoft Technical Education
Computer Decisions Inc.
Phone 919.460.7604
Alpha Pager (Raleigh) 919.389.2695
mikebabb@vnet.net
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Jun 1997 19:08:38 -0400
From: DMC12
Subject: Re: DML: Re: NJ Cruise Night
Marc Levy wrote:
>I think I will pass on the Balloon fair.. I hate crowds! =
>I have verified with Freehold Ford (major sponsor of cruise night) that the
last thursday of every month this summer will be Cruise Night in downtown
freehold.
>As of now, I plan on attending June 26. We can all just show up and look for
each other's cars, or we could plan ahead and all drive in together (really turn
some heads!).
I think we should meet somewhere before hand on June 26 and all cruise in
together
Hope to meet some of you on the 26th
Doug Venner N.J.
83 DeLorean
78 MG Midget
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 01:16:57 +0000
From: BRUCE BENSON Subject: DML: Turbos
First, to answer Knut's question, the center shaft that spins the rotor in the
distributor is geared off moving parts in the engine. When you loosen the
hold down screw and rotate the distributor housing, cap and all, the rotor
doesn't move. You move the cap and stator plate in relation to the rotor.
The engine vacuum is built up in a reservoir tank housed inside the drivers
side rear quarter panel. It has a check valve in the line so as the engine revs
and the vacuum begins to disappear, the reservoir maintains a steady level of
operating vacuum. If cars didn't have this the vacuum would never stay
constant. The turbo charger force feeds air to the engine and as it builds
momentum, it begins to replace the negative ( vacuum ) atmosphere in
the intake manifold with a positive charge. Under most conditions nothing
will be effected in the cars operating systems by this because of the vacuum
reservoir maintaining the constant level of vacuum. Under certain high
speed
operation I have noticed the air conditioning doors closing momentarily in
the dash when engine vacuum is low for extended periods disapating the
level
of vacuum in the reservoir and then the turbo comes on boost. Contrary to
what Chase said, the turbo does not increase vacuum. It does just the
opposite.
Bruce Benson
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Jun 1997 21:36:47 -0400 (EDT) From: Phillip124@aol.com
Subject: Re: DML: RE: Engine Fans Update
I connected the sockets that you told me to, but the fans still work the same
way as they did with the original relay. They run for 1 minute and shut off,
then they try to come on several times, but they never run for more than 2
seconds. I have to get out onto the freeway so that the air can rush through
the radiator. If I don't get on the freeway, the temp will keep rising...it
has gotten up to the first red caution mark before. But as soon as I get out
onto the freeway, the temp goes back down. I do not know about that
"jumping
the thermal switch in the coolant pipe on the left side of the engine. If they
come on then, replace the thermal switch". I don't know where this is
or what it looks like or what it does (I assume that it is a switch that activates
the fans when the engine gets to the temp where they need to be on).
Thank You (I'll try to stay on the freeway when I drive this car for now)
Phillip vin 7134
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Jun 1997 22:22:01 -0400 (EDT) From: DMC81sle@aol.com
Subject: DML: Re: Inside rearview mirror replacement
The other day I got into my '81 D and when I shut the door the rear view
mirror fell off the windshield. I seem to remember hearing of someone who
managed to crack their windshield when reataching their mirror in a similar
situation. Any words of wisdom or precations from the list before I attempt
to perform this procedure would be most appreciated. Thanks !!!!!
Scott Engelhart
#1604
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Jun 1997 23:58:40 -0400 (EDT) From: Chittim@aol.com
Subject: Re: DML: Windshield Replacement Advice?
I am interested in finding out what people are paying for new windshields
since mine has a crack in it too!!
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 12 Jun 1997 21:09:51 -0500
From: Duke
Subject: DML: web page update
Well I finally typed in the article that goes along with the picture of = what
was to be the next DeLorean. I've also added some links as well. = If you know
of any other links please e-mail them to me.
Thanks and enjoy!
Duke Bladorn
www.geocities.com/motorcity/8952/delorean.html
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 10:08:44 -0500
From: Bill Marcussen Subject: Re: DML:
Windshield Replacement Advice?
What about using windshield repair for dings or cracks. There are several
methods and technologies out there today that repair not only stone dings but
cracks as well. With the difficulty associated with locating, buying and
installing a replacement windshield, I think trying a repair would be an
obvious alternative.
If anyone has tried the repair route, I would be interested in hearing about
their results.
Thanks,
Bill
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 11:41:50 -0400 (EDT) From: "Eric J. Hennebury"
Subject: DML: Valve covers.
Well, an attempt to fix some leaky exhaust manifold gaskets has resulted in
the removal of the engine from my car (the only way I could get enough
clearance to extract the broken studs. By the way, engine removal was not
nearly as scary as I thought, although I'm sure I'll have some neat stories to
tell by the time I complete re-installation.
Since I have the engine out, I've been doing a little clean up as well. I've
noticed that in the brochures, the valve covers on the engine are black, but
mine are raw aluminum. I'm curious if anyone else has black valve covers
(I'm toying with the idea of powder coating them, but I'd rather not deviate
too far from stock). Also, if anyone has suggestions as to how to clean the
oxidization off of the valve covers to restore that "new" look, I'd love to hear
them. Thanks in advance,
Eric
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 08:40:30 +0000
From: ausmith@pdx.oneworld.com
Subject: Re: DML: Turbos
Bruce said,
(Snip)
>Contrary to what Chase said, the turbo does not increase
vvacuum. It does just the opposite.
My mistake. I looked at the routing of the vacuum hose with the air cleaner
in place and it looked to be plumbed to the mixture unit lower housing. I just
removed the air cleaner and find that it's really connected to the passenger
side rail of the inlet manifold. This part is under pressure.
However the vacuum for the distributor is pulled from the mixture control
unit and would increase under boost.
Chris
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 12:02:19 -0400
From: Mike Substelny Subject: DML: Phillip's
fan failure continues . . .
>. . . the fans still work the same way as they did with the original relay. They
run for 1 minute and shut off,then they try to come on several times, but they
never run for more than 2 seconds . . . I'll try to stay on the freeway when I
drive this car for now . . .
Phillip, I advise you not to drive the car in this condition! If you get stopped
at a traffic light or railroad crossing you WILL burst a coolant line. When a
coolant line goes you will lose all of your coolant in just a few seconds, and if
you don't stop the engine quickly you will cause very serious damage.
It should be easy to diagnose and correct your problem. The first thing to do is
to try to force the fans to run by activating the air conditioner. The fans
should run most of the time when the air conditioner switch is in the "ON"
position EVEN IF THE ENGINE IS NOT RUNNING.
I believe if you turn your key to the "on" position (don't start the engine)
then turn on the a/c the cooling fans should come on instantly. This feature
provides extra cooling action to keep the A/Cs heat exchanger cool. I am not
sure if this trick works for car's with non-functional air conditioning.
If the cooling fans don't come on this might mean that you have not
connected those bypass wires correctly. Go over the instructions for the bypass
again. If the bypass was really done right it is also possible that you have a bad
relay (we'll cross that bridge later if we come to it).
Obviously if the fans DO come on when you activate the A/C this gives you
the option of running the A/C to keep your car cool at traffic lights. I suppose
this won't do any harm, but it makes you look silly if you are driving around
with a young lady on a chilly evening and you keep turning the A/C on and
off. :-)
The next thing you need to do is locate the temp sensor that controls the fans.
Several of us have correctly described its location to you. It is a small
electronic module about the size and shape of one finger's knuckle. Two
wires come out of the back, while the front protrudes into a large coolant line
on the bottom driver's side of the engine compartment. You must get under
the car to see it, although you do not need to raise the car up.
If you still cannot find the sensor then I suggest you order a service manual
from DMC Houston, DeLorean One, DMC Garden City, PJ Grady, etc.. This
book includes a nice illustration which shows the location of the sensor.
You do not need to remove the sensor, just unplug those two wires. This
only takes a few seconds and will not cause any coolant to spill. Take the
socket at the end of the two wires and place a jumper wire (probe, paper clip,
whatever) across it. This will simulate hot engine conditions, and when the
key is turned the fans should come on.
Please take good care of that car, Phillip. Keep us posted on your progress.
- - Mike Substelny
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 13 Jun 97 10:54:03 -0000
From: James Espey
Subject: DML: Re: Temp Sensor Location
>The next thing you need to do is locate the temp sensor that controls the
fans. Several of us have correctly described its location to you. It is a small
electronic module about the size and shape of one finger's knuckle. Two
wires come out of the back, while the front protrudes into a large coolant line
on the bottom driver's side of the engine compartment. You must get under
the car to see it, although you do not need to raise the car up.
I believe that it is also pretty well illustrated in the Parts Manual, Section 1-3-
1.
Incidentally, this section of the Parts Manual is downloadable in PDF format
from the DMC-News web site at:
http://www.dmcnews.com/PM01.pdf
James
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 14:43:26 -0500
From: Bill Marcussen Subject: DML: Tires
Looks like I am going to have to replace a set of rear tires. I know that the
original Goodyear design & size are no longer in production and have read
on the list about Yokahamas and differing opinions on their
suitability/unsuitability. I would be interested in hearing what brand, design
& size tires others are running on their Ds, and how suitable they are as
replacement tires.
Any & all recommendations would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Bill
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 22:21:03 +0000
From: BRUCE BENSON Subject: DML: Re:
Engine Fan Cooling Update
Phillip said:
>I do not know about that "jumping the thermal switch in the coolant pipe
on >the left side of the engine. If they come on then, replace the thermal
switch". > I don't know where this is or what it looks like or what it does
(I >assume that
>it is a switch that activates the fans when the engine gets to the temp
where >they need to be on).
If the relay up-date was done correctly and the Freon charge is ok the problem
is very likley in the temperature switch. The switch is located in the coolant
pipe along the drivers side of the engine. On early cars the switch was on top
of the pipe and if there was air in the coolant, erratic fan operation was
possible. The contacts in the temperature switch must be immersed in water
to make continuity. Obviously an air bubble would be at the top of the pipe
and interrupt the connection so subsequent cars had the
switch installed at the bottom of the pipe. Pulling the two wires off the switch
and connecting them to each other via a jumper should make the fans run
continuously. If this doesn't work look for dirty or corroded connections at
the plugs hanging from the fan motors themselves.
Bruce Benson
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 22:35:23 +0100 (utc) From: Jim Lill
Subject: Re: DML: Valve covers.
On Fri, 13 Jun 1997, Eric J. Hennebury wrote:
>Also, if anyone has
>suggestions as to how to clean the oxidization off of the valve covers to
restore that "new" look, I'd love to hear them.
A walnut shell blast job might be the answer.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 13 Jun 1997 19:03:06 -0800
From: ian@inow.com (Ian)
Subject: DML: Another sad DeLorean in trouble story.
Hello list,
Because of Brandon Moody's story and replies I thought I would post this
email which I worte a while ago and had not sent. I too have found a sad
looking DeLoren pleading for help...
[written 6.6.97]
This past week has been full of DeLorean sighting's and findings. In one day I
found 2 DeLoreans in my area! One of them, an '83, is rather beat up with
tears throughout the interior and medium sun damage. Its perfect!
This is the DeLorean which I would like you (if you would ) to estimate the
value of. I'll be taking pictures (if it quits raining) soon but for now I only
have my description:
The car sits in a long drive way in Redwood City. (5 min away) There is a
good collection of weeds which have grown up around the car, its last
registration sticker is 92. It is exposed, without and type of car cover or
overhang. Both the "DMC" on the grill and the "DeLorean" script on the
hood have been _spray painted_ silver with a good amount of over-spray on
both. The blocks of wood and tape used as masking still sit at the feet of the
front tires. The original NCT's sit half deflated and the flared tail pipes have
chrome add-on's mounted. The interior is shot. There is a dash cover on the
obviously destroyed (by UV) dash, the drivers side has a classy stripe of Duct
tape on the left side and the passenger seat is covered in worn sheep skins.
The left side front fender has a dime shaped indent on the edge. It looks
much like a hammer was taken to that one spot. The black areas are, of
course, spotted with sun damage and the thing is in rather poor shape.
I know a lot of you are squirming at this, I know... It was hard to look at for
me too. Until my friend mentioned that it was the only DeLorean I could
afford right now... which got me thinking.
Its either my nightmare or my dream... but how do I tell? I did not look at the
chassis and have no idea what kind of red uglies (rust for the un-imaginative)
lurk.
What do you recommend I check out the next time I'm there? I'll probably
not be able to talk to the owner as last time the place was deserted and I'll be
back there at the same time of day.
[end of the old email]
Well, we finally talked to the neighbor and she (an elderly woman) said the
car has sat for the past 10 years! And that they (the owners) have _never_
been outside or talked to anyone. If any off you saw that X-Files with the
mother on the plywood sheet and the three 'brothers' you get the picture of
what the house looked like. I was kida scared to go look at the car with the
house looking the way it did.
We did get the wife to open the door and when I my friend asked weather the
DeLorean was for sale (we were both dumbfounded that the door opened) she
said "NO!" and slammed the door on our faces.
Oh well, I would have loved to restore that stainless steed. I would still like to
know what you think the fair asking price would be for a car in that kind of
shape. Assuming the engine is of average (vague I know) mileage and just
needs some... tune up work, lets say a few hundred in parts. What would be
your guess at the price?
thanks,
Ian Haddock
The Men of Stainless Steel... DMCNews.com (unauthorized tag line)
- ----
Anyone in the Menlo Park area who wouldn't mind having lunch at the
local Deli or such with another enthusiast email me as I love to talk to you.
Ok, back to the interesting stuff...
The last set of emails concerning the DOA have truly set my opinion of their
worth. It's to bad they are such a shoddy organization... there are obviously
many, many owners more enthused and ready to go-for-it who would be
much better picks to run things. Sigh, I guess that $60 a year now goes to the
DeLorean savings account. ;-)
I looked through the Owners Manual and there is no mention of the Radio
specifications. What are these? And can this deck (Craig, ASI) power upgraded
speakers without large amounts of line static? I would love to keep the
original deck but would like some clearer, more powerful music abilities than
standard.
What sizes are the speaker holes? I know there 4in in the front, but are they
6+1/2'' in the back or 8''? I can't remember.
------------------------------
End of dmcnews-digest V2 #252
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