DeLorean Mailing List - 2/14/97
dmcnews-digest Friday, 14 February 1997 Volume 02 : Number 212
In this issue:
Re: Starting problems...
DOA Members Los Angeles Region
Re: This months Hemmings Motor News
JZD wasn't the only "fool"
Turbochargers
Re: JZD wasn't the only "fool"
Re: Turbochargers
RIGHT / LEFT SEAT
re: Starting problems...
dmcnews-digest V2 #211 -Reply
re: Starting problems...
Accidents!
DeLorean accident rate update
Re: Accidents!
Re: RIGHT / LEFT SEAT
CORVETTE BRAKE LIGHT
Re: dmcnews-digest V2 #211 -Reply
Re: dmcnews-digest V2 #211 -Reply
Re: Turbochargers
Re: Accidents!
Re: dmcnews-digest V2 #211 -Reply
Re: Breakaway Mirrors
Re: Accidents!
Third Brake Light
A DMC for your VCR!
Re: CORVETTE BRAKE LIGHT
Re: CORVETTE BRAKE LIGHT
Re: Breakaway Mirrors
Alleged Kit Cars and the 1983 Market
DeLorean Price
Re: JZD wasn't the only "fool"
JZD and the Pontiac Banshee
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: RazzzzD@aol.com
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 23:00:06 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Starting problems...
Phillip,
When i bought my DMC-12, I had the same problems. I needed to replace the
following;
1. Fuel Pump.
2. Temperature Switch
After I replace both items my DMC-12 started on the first shot. Raz
------------------------------
From: "John W. Herron" Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 22:57:02
-0700
Subject: DOA Members Los Angeles Region
Fellow So.Cal DOA Members:
Recently joined DOA and would like to meet local members. Have several tech
questions and seek advice/tips on restoration. I reside in W. LA.
I can be emailed at: herron@scf.usc.edu
Your assistance would be greatly appreciated.
Lunch on me...
Regards,
John
DOA #5212
VIN #4115
------------------------------
From: STANDLOR@aol.com
Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 01:50:45 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: This months Hemmings
Motor News
Jim-
Just thought I woould let you know that I talked with the fella at Rightway
Salvage Yard today. Thats the place with the Delorean in the front mounted
on the riser bin advertising the junk yard. I told him I was interested in a
seat either right or left since they are identical (which he didn't know) and
he came back with a price of $795.00, and he couldn't tell me the condition
of the seat!
I think in the long run, you might be barking up the wrong tree looking for
parts from him, as he thinks the car he has is a "money tree" and will reap
him big profits from those rich guys who own Deloreans! Stan
------------------------------
From: GullWinged@aol.com
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 23:08:15 -0500 (EST) Subject: JZD wasn't the only "fool"
First off, I am sorry if this appears twice. I thought I sent it a few days
ago but never received it back from the Live DMC List and assume it never made
it there. Now on to the show.
People have often criticized JZD for placing the factory in Ireland and
talking about the civil unrest, unskilled workers, high unemployment, etc.
But I came across a story the other day that proves he isn't the only "fool"
to locate a factory in the country.
>* The head of INTEL Ireland, the biggest supplier of
ssemi-conductors to Europe, says locating in Ireland has proved very positive
for the international high-technology conglomerate. General manager Frank
McCabe said that the success of the 4,000-strong Irish plant was key to Intel's
decision to build a new $1.5 billion facility at its Leixlip site, close to
Ireland's capital, Dublin. Intel Ireland produced the world's first eight-inch
wafers of pure silicon and is the world's biggest supplier of Pentium chips.
(Reuters 03:20 AM ET 02/06/97) For the full text story, see
>http://www.merc.com/stories/cgi/story.cgi?id=1418890-da5
Ireland is the world's largest producers of Pentium chips!?! For us Apple
lovers, such as James and I, this just adds more fuel to the fire on why
Macintosh is superior. :)
~ Chase
------------------------------
From: Mpeak@aol.com
Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 00:03:40 -0500 (EST) Subject: Turbochargers
Recently, I received information in the mail on the twin turbo from Turbo
manifold Co. Although I think the system looks rather impressive, the $5,000
price tag was unbelievable judging that a new engine costs $6,000. I was
wondering what turbochargers people on the list are using. There appear to
be more out there than I know of. So far I have heard of the twin turbo from
Turbo Manifold, the BAE turbocharger, and the IHI twin turbo system. Turbo
users, are you happy with the ones you are using? What are the prices on
these various models and how do their performances compare? Anybody using a
Volvo turbocharging system?
Matt
------------------------------
From: raddad@cmn.net
Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 07:15:46 -0700
Subject: Re: JZD wasn't the only "fool"
Chase said, in part
>People have often criticized JZD for placing the factory in Ireland and talking
about the civil unrest, unskilled workers, high unemployment, etc. But I came
across a story the other day that proves he isn't the only "fool" to locate a
factory in the country.
>Ireland is the world's largest producers of Pentium chips!?! For us Apple lovers,
such as James and I, this just adds more fuel to the fire on why Macintosh is
superior. :)
>~ Chase
Being Irish I think I can say this - We write, we sing, we bullshit, we laugh
and we make the world's best beer, but please don't ask us to do anything
technical.
Written on a Mac with Guiness in hand.
Dick Ryan
------------------------------
From: raddad@cmn.net
Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 07:22:16 -0700
Subject: Re: Turbochargers
Matt, I have the Island Turbo setup. BTW, these are IHI turbos. I had 50,000
on my car when they were installed and have added another 40,000 since then.
They are smooth and very responsive at "mid-range and above". Incidentally,
I also have the automatic transmission and I am told that it really won't
stand up to the extra horsepower of the turbos. The current condition of it
would seem to bear that out. If you plan to do GT type cruising, the turbos
are a real pleaure. However, only you can determine what they are worth to you.
BTW, I have seen some very nice installations of RAJAY turbos on a couple of
DeLoreans.
Dick Ryan
------------------------------
From: "Don Gowler-CFPO01" Date: Thu, 13
Feb 1997 8:30:00 -0600
Subject: RIGHT / LEFT SEAT
SOMEONE WROTE "I told him I was interested in a seat either right or left since
they are identical" AND I HOPE THEY REALIZE THAT THE SEAT BACK HAS A LEVER ON
IT'S SIDE FACING TO THE OUTSIDE OF THE CAR TO ALLOW THE SEAT BACK TO BE TILTED
EITHER FORWARDS OR BACKWARDS; THEREFORE, THE SEATS ARE DIFFERENT.
I HAVE TWO EXTRA SEATS AND BRAND NEW GREY ORIGINAL COVERINGS IN SUPERB/UNUSED
CONDITION - CALL ME IF YOUR INTERESTED. cfpo01@email.mot.com
REGARDS, THE SILVER FOX
------------------------------
From: dadams@etcconnect.com (Dennis Adams) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 10:25:36 -0600
Subject: re: Starting problems...
------------------------------
From: Aaron Barrus
Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 09:20:18 -0700
Subject: dmcnews-digest V2 #211 -Reply
Mike Substelny,
I think we need to add another figure to your list. How many times has another
vehicle ran into something OTHER THAN your delorean while admiring it?
I admit to driving off the freeway into a median, and almost up onto a sidewalk
once, until the curb cought my attention. No accidents yet, fortunately. Until
I own one, I take every opportunity to admire them.
Aaron
------------------------------
From: dadams@etcconnect.com (Dennis Adams) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 10:25:36 -0600
Subject: re: Starting problems...
------------------------------
From: ausmith@pdx.oneworld.com
Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 11:39:48 +0000
Subject: Accidents!
Hi all,
Write to Delorean World. I sent them an article on the insatllation of a third
brake light a year and a half ago. Talked to John Truscott on the phone and
faxed him a picture. It requires no drilling or any permanent changes other
than wire splicing. Never got to print! It also looks "right" on the car.
I think our cars need this accessory for safety. We are low, and close to the
same color as the pavement.
Chris
------------------------------
From: Mike Substelny Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 15:14:12 -0500
Subject: DeLorean accident rate update
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
These figures are provided strictly for the amusement of DML readers.
This non-scientific survey should not be construed to have any statistical
significance due to the small sample size, STRONGLY biased sampling technique,
and unvalidatable assumptions made during analysis.
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
So far, with a handful of respondents in, we have these results (figures
rounded off for ease of reading):
DeLorean drivers seem to get hit once every 66,500 miles, no matter what
car we are driving.
Our non-DeLorean cars get hit once about every 92,000 miles.
Our DeLoreans get hit once about every 46,000 miles.
So right now it looks like DeLoreans get hit twice as often as non-DeLoreans
when driven by the same people. Amazing!
The current trend goes against my instinct. One possible explanation would be
if people who have had an accident are simply more likely to respond to this
survey than people who haven't. I honestly expected to get a lot more "zero
accident" responses than I did.
Maybe other drivers really do get distracted by our cars and loose control a
lot! OTOH Chris had a point when he said, "We are low, and close to the same
color as the pavement."
Once again, don't take these numbers too seriously. If they inspire you to
become a more careful driver that's great. But their main purpose is just to
give us something to chat about.
I will update these numbers next week, assuming some of the Digest subscribers
have yet to respond.
And for crying out loud, let's be CAREFUL out there!
- -Mike Substelny
------------------------------
From: raddad@cmn.net
Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 13:58:37 -0700
Subject: Re: Accidents!
>Hi all,
>Write to Delorean World. I sent them an article on the insatllation of a
third brake light a year and a half ago. Talked to John Truscott on the phone
and faxed him a picture. It requires no drilling or any permanent changes
other than wire splicing. Never got to print! It also looks "right" on the car.
>I think our cars need this accessory for safety. We are low, and close to the
same color as the pavement.
>Chris
I agree. I installed a corvette third brake light years ago. It looks as if it
was designed for the car. It looks so natural that most people are surprised to
find that it was a "custom" installation. It brings a brake light up to eye
level of the person behind you (fits on top louvre). I know a number of others
who have installed the same light.
Dick Ryan
------------------------------
From: raddad@cmn.net
Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 14:01:07 -0700
Subject: Re: RIGHT / LEFT SEAT
Interesting point Don. Wonder how many people might have discovered that by accident?
BTW, I have been trying to email you directly, but all mail comes back!!Help!!
Dick Ryan
------------------------------
From: "Don Gowler-CFPO01" Date: Thu, 13 Feb
1997 15:40:00 -0600
Subject: CORVETTE BRAKE LIGHT
Dick, can we hear more about the Corvette brake light setup. What year? What
wiring routing? Exact location for mounting? Mounting fasteners?
Thanks Dick. Regards, The Silver Fox
------------------------------
From: "denise"
Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 21:23:32 -0000
Subject: Re: dmcnews-digest V2 #211 -Reply
Hello my name is John, and I am new to the group. I am a Delorean Owner, two
of them. So I would like to ask a question here. Does anyone know how
many Deloreans were actually made? Also another question would any Delorean
owners like to get together for a chat?
All the best for now, John.
------------------------------
From: mack777@ix.netcom.com (James McBurney) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 17:28:48
-0600 (CST) Subject: Re: dmcnews-digest V2 #211 -Reply
John,
I think that there were in the area of 8,500 DeLorean's made.
------------------------------
From: BRUCE BENSON Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 23:44:53
+0000
Subject: Re: Turbochargers
What are the prices on
>these various models and how do their performances compare? Anybody using a
>Volvo turbocharging system?
>Matt
There are an infinite number of turbocharger configurations to match an equally
infinite number of engine configurations. Volvo only turbocharges the 4 cyl so
that system wouldn't work well with the B28 engine in the DeLorean. I had Turbo
City in Orange California size a Rajay turbo for me based on the displacement of
the engine and rpm range it begins to develop its torque. I'm pretty sure its
the same turbo BAE used. BAE, by the way, is no longer in business. My system
is a cross between the BAE and Island Turbo
setups. Don Steger, at the DeLOREAN MOTOR CENTER, bought the remaining DeLorean
kits from BAE several years ago. I have no idea if he has anything
left.
Bruce Benson
------------------------------
From: STANDLOR@aol.com
Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 22:05:52 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Accidents!
In a message dated 97-02-13 15:01:33 EST, you write:
<< I sent them an article on the insatllationof a third brake light a year
and a half ago. >> Chris- Perhaps I missed something! I have not seen any
discusstion or cross
talk about the installation of the third lite (stoplight), but so help me, I
was thinking of this same subject while traveling home tonight from work.
Many guys have installed the chevy corvette 3rd lite on the top of the Delorean
and it not only looks good, but acts good! What type of lite were
you inferring to? Is it a stock lite, how would you attach it to the vehicle,
clamps, etc? How would you string your wires to attach to brake circut etc.
From what the other guys have told me, if you drill the corvette light through
the body permanently, you bring the wires also through
the body and attach to the brake circut behind the package shelf where the
wires are completely hidden, the bolts are hidden and the job looks great and
professional. Has anyone done this job?
Stan
------------------------------
From: STANDLOR@aol.com
Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 22:23:21 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: dmcnews-digest V2 #211 -Reply
In a message dated 97-02-13 18:15:54 EST, you write:
<< Does anyone know how many Deloreans were actually made? >> John-
Delorean Owners Association magazine (Delorean World) Vol. I Book 2 Winter
1983 page 18 lower -
Model year - 1981- 6539
1982- 1126
1983- 918
The last figure of 1983 includes those cars produced by the DMC under John Z
and those produced by Consolidated who finished production on many cars left
on the assembly line when the factory was closed. Those late production cars
were made from parts that were in many cases, discarded by the origianl line
as undesirable, or unfit parts, to be used in the construction of the car under
the guideance of John Z.
Stan
------------------------------
From: dlwrence@ix.netcom.com
Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 22:08:44 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: Breakaway Mirrors
In regards to the breakaway mirrors mentioned by Chase: My 1992 Explorer also
has those kinds of mirrors, and on the 1992+ Isuzu Trooper, the breakaway
mirrors are power operated, allowing you to fold them in at the touch of a
switch. These kind of mirrors come in real handy if you aren't paying attention
and nail the side of the garage door opening as you are backing out.
~Chris
P.S. Sorry that this wasn't really DeLorean related.
------------------------------
From: STANDLOR@aol.com
Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 22:13:52 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Accidents!
In a message dated 97-02-13 16:04:52 EST, you write:
<< I installed a corvette third brake light years ago. >> Dick -
See my note to Chris since his note was on the board before yours! What year
corvette did your lite come off of? How is yours wired since it is mounted
on the louvre, not on the body? Any information you can give me would be greatly
appreciated.
Just to make a comment. The first time I truly noticed the 3rd lite was at
the Los Veges convention a few years back. We were on the road out of town
and were all driving in file. When I looked down the column, the only thing
that stood out was one of the Deloreans with his high wind deflector on the
rear, and the Delorean that braked every so often and could be seen over the
top of all the other cars as he applied his brakes. I mentioned to my wife
at that time that that is the greatest safety feature I have ever seen for the
Delorean and someone should make it available to all members of the Club.
I havent't done it yet , but I guarentee you I shall have it one my car within
a couple of months.
Stan
------------------------------
From: "John W. Herron" Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 20:57:35 -0700
Subject: Third Brake Light
Stan:
I am interested in installing a third brake light as well. This is what I know
about it...
Don Steger at DeLorean Motor Center installs them for a little over two bills.
The brake light itself is around $160. I asked him about what vehicle it came
off of and he didnt tell me much...now I know they are off of an 'vette.
Third brake lights were installed on U.S. autos starting from 1985.
Let me know if you find out what year 'vette they came off of.
Regards,
John
------------------------------
From: "Eric "
Date: Fri, 14 Feb 1997 00:09:27 -0500
Subject: A DMC for your VCR!
V2#211 had a few posts regarding video, to which I add;
The History Channel had a one hour documentary on Pontiac, mostly the Firebird.
Interesting was the 1966 Banshee Show Car code named XP798. This was JZD's
concept of a *Mustang Fighter* with all wheel independent suspension, a 421 V8,
and fold down rear seats. Of note were the doors; flip-up panels on the roof
augmented the passenger doors.
The Banshee was never shown to the public: GM President Cole thought it would
eat into the Corvette's market share and Chevrolet was developing the
F Car which became the Camaro/Firebird. One could guess that the doors of the
Banshee made their way into the design parameters of the DMC-12 in 1975, but
there was no mention of this.
Note that in 1988 the Banshee name was revived by Pontiac into a Show Car to
demonstrate a *Firebird for the "90's*, so any references may get confused
here since the 1966 Show Car was never really, well, Shown.
The History Channel also has a series called Year By Year; a documentary
featuring the news stories of any given year. You may want to keep an eye
out for 1982 or 1984 for obvious reasons. Check here
http://www.historychannel.com for air times in the future.
And should I mention the catalog page from a source of dirty movies someone
passed along to me? Well, this is a family-friendly List, so all I will say
is that there is a certain video that features a DMC-12 with a well-endowed
woman leaning against it. I don't know if there really is a DMC-12 in the
video beyond the picture, but if you want to find out for yourself and are
over 21, email me and I will pass along the name of the company that has
this, uh, movie.
Eric Friedebach aerostar@ccia.com
------------------------------
From: raddad@cmn.net
Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 22:31:38 -0700
Subject: Re: CORVETTE BRAKE LIGHT
I'll need to check on the year - pre 1988. On the Corvette, it is installed on
the roof. I did not want to drill into the roof and, besides,
the light isn't stainless steel. Move the light down onto the top louvre and
center it.. Move it as far forward as necessary to have the lens flush
with the end of the louvre. You will have to drill one hole into the louvre to
feed the wires through from the underside of the light. The light attaches with
cement - no bolts or other fasteners to affect the clean look. Wires run to the
"grill" where the torsion bar adjustment bolts are located - through one of the
grill openings and then over to the right to feed through the rear quarter panel
and become spliced into the wiring just before it attaches to the rear light
"board".
You only need to leave a 1/2" or so "loose" wire extending from the top of the
louvre to the grill. It will not interfer when opening and closing the
louvre.
Paint the light with urethane "bumper black" and voila, you have a light that
is waterproof, reliable, bright, easy to see and looks like it was put
on at the factory.
Dick Ryan
P.S. I suppose one could exit the grill and hook in behind the passenger seat,
but by putting the light where I did, you would have more wire showing. You
would have to be looking hard to see any exposed wires the way mine is set up.
------------------------------
From: raddad@cmn.net
Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 22:40:30 -0700
Subject: Re: CORVETTE BRAKE LIGHT
Oops - I goofed. I had a nagging feeling I might have. It has been a long
time since the light was installed. There are two bolts that hold it onto
the louvre. They are not visible from except from the underside of the louvre.
All else is as stated before. Sorry.
Dick Ryan
------------------------------
From: "Marvin S. Sterling" Date: Fri, 14 Feb 1997
03:34:26 -0800
Subject: Re: Breakaway Mirrors
dlwrence@ix.netcom.com wrote:
>In regards to the breakaway mirrors mentioned by Chase: My 1992 Explorer also
>has those kinds of mirrors, and on the 1992+ Isuzu Trooper, the breakaway
mirrors are power operated, allowing you to fold them in at the touch of a
>switch. These kind of mirrors come in real handy if you aren't paying
attention and nail the side of the garage door opening as you are backing out.
>~Chris
>P.S. Sorry that this wasn't really DeLorean related.
- ------------------------------------------
Chris,
If you nail the D's breakaway mirrors backing out of the garage you will rip them
off of the car ... they only fold out to ninety degrees but they do fold
forward ... they are not really breakaway. Regards,
Marv Sterling
------------------------------
From: "Eric "
Date: Fri, 14 Feb 1997 01:45:42 -0500
Subject: Alleged Kit Cars and the 1983 Market
In V2 #211 CDIUSAMPS@aol.com wrote:
>Subject: Kit Car (Alleged)
>You guys will love this. Yesterday, while driving my Delo, I was stopped
>by
>a group of individuals who wanted to talk Deloreans. When they asked to look
>at the engine, I popped the back. I was then told I was driving a kit car,
>DMC look alike, as the real DMC 12 was a front engine, 351 Ford powered vehicle.
Great look alike, but not the real thing. No matter how much I tried to convince
them they were wrong it was like talking to a brick wall. I
>even tried to jog their memory alittle by bringing up the Bricklin, but they
>still did not believe me. And this whole time I thought I knew my vehicle,
>I'm so embarassed that I was ripped off when I bought it. BILL
Some time back I came across a brochure for the Cimbria SS, a gull-winged spots
car that, well, seemed to say *build me* instead of *buy me*, circa 1983. There
was also a whole box of materials that were included with it that I was not
able to secure.
The brochure is along the same line of quality of the DMC-12 brochure, but if
you pay attention to the details you can see some JC Whitney parts here and
there. The copy reads "Advanced Automotive Technologies, Ltd. is proud to
present the Cimbria SS... the culmination of a decade of engineering development
and production experience in the world of prestige car design".
Seems to be a kit car. It looks nothing like a DMC-12 beyond the gull wing
doors. The brochure I have makes no mention of the engine whatsoever. One is
available at http://www.vmarket.com/p83.htm
Eric Friedebach aerostar@ccia.com
------------------------------
From: Scott Tester Date: Fri, 14 Feb 1997
03:30:45 -0500 (EST) Subject: DeLorean Price
I was talking to a friend about the DeLorean. As soon as he could speak he
said, "hey, you can't get that car, it's $100,000 or more!!" Unable to
convince him of the real price range until I got a Hemmings! Now he wants
one....
Scott Tester testersd@appstate.campus.mci.net
------------------------------
From: jory bell
Date: Fri, 14 Feb 1997 01:17:55 -0800
Subject: Re: JZD wasn't the only "fool"
>Chase said, in part
>>People have often criticized JZD for placing the factory in Ireland and talking
about the civil unrest, unskilled workers, high unemployment, etc. But I came
across a story the other day that proves he isn't the only "fool" to locate a
factory in the country.
>>Ireland is the world's largest producers of Pentium chips!?! For us Apple
lovers, such as James and I, this just adds more fuel to the fire on why
Macintosh is superior. :)
>>~ Chase
>Being Irish I think I can say this - We write, we sing, we bullshit, we
laugh and we make the world's best beer, but please don't ask us to do anything
technical.
>Written on a Mac with Guiness in hand.
>Dick Ryan
Apple has a large production facility in Cork Ireland - I worked there for
a time lat year. Motorola and other wafer fabs are alo located there.
::jory
------------------------------
From: Mike Substelny Date: Fri, 14 Feb 1997 09:29:39 -0500
Subject: JZD and the Pontiac Banshee
Eric said:
>The History Channel had a one hour documentary on Pontiac, mostly the Firebird.
Interesting was the 1966 Banshee Show Car . . .
The Banshee is now part of the Bortz "Dream Car" collection. The Bortz
father/son team collects concept cars that were never mass produced. Some of
the cars (including the Banshee) circulate from city to city as they are
displayed in various car museums from time to time.
I saw the Banshee when it visited Cleveland in 1995. I think it was a 1963
model code number XP-833. It was a white, convertible, two-seater sports car.
The Banshee was created while John DeLorean was running Pontiac by engineer
Bill Collins.
DeLorean later hired Collins to engineer another project of his, the DMC-12!
While our production DeLoreans do look very much like the car Collins designed,
when Lotus took over the project they made radical changes. In my opinion
the DeLorean would have been better off if it were built to Collins' original
specs. Unfortunately his design required the EMR underbody, which for some
reason failed to materialize.
James has a picture of the Banshee that I saw. If there is interest among the
subscribers, perhaps some day that picture can appear on the DML home page.
- -Mike Substelny
------------------------------
End of dmcnews-digest V2 #212
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