DeLorean Mailing List - 03/01/96


Volume 02 : Number 080

       In this issue:
        Vacuum leaks, Brakes, Door Locks and Heater Fan
        RE: worried...
        Re: dmcnews-digest V2 #77
        Re: Super DeLorean
        [none]
        Re: Various Mechanical Maladies
        Re: Single Key DeLoreans
        Another option for worried buyers
        AC Freon Charge
        New owners, painted cars...
        Re: Various Mechanical Maladies
        HotWheels/speedometer
        Wiper problem
        DeLorean Photo Posted in Newsgroup

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: stormrider(AT)socketis.net (Chase Clark)
Date: Wed, 28 Feb 1996 13:53:01 -0600
Subject: Vacuum leaks, Brakes, Door Locks and Heater Fan

Here I go with the technical questions again. I hope you are all ready for them.

1) My heater/AC fan does not function. The fan speed selector knob is bent
and it may be the switch needs to be replaced, but before I do that I was
wondering if there are any relays or inline fuses I should check out first?

2) There is a hissing sound that comes from the centre console of my dash
(around the climate control knobs) that continues for about 30 seconds or
so after the engine has been turned off. I already have been told that this
is caused by a vacuum leak.

What I want to know is other people's experience with diagnosing these
leaks and how many other systems they can affect? My brakes are a bit weak,
and when I got to thinking about it last night, I began to wonder if the
vacuum boost system for the power brakes is tied in with the same vacuum
system that runs the ventilation and engine vacuum? If so, maybe my brakes
will have a better bite when the leak is fixed.

3) Less technically, but definitely a concern for me is how do you get into
a DeLorean if the power locks refuse to release and let you in and how
common a problem is this? The linkages on my driver's door are annoying me
to no end and I plan on spending a coupel of warm afternoons soon digging
into the guts of the door and replacing/adjusting the release linkages.
While I am in there, I also plan to reconnect all the locking mechanisms
that the previous owner disabled. I would just like to know that I can get
back into the car if it refuses to open up without having to wait for the
battery to run dry.

As always, tinkering and loving it.

~ Chase



------------------------------

From: OffroadPEZ(AT)aol.com
Date: Wed, 28 Feb 1996 18:00:02 -0500
Subject: RE: worried...

Jeffrey-

I'm in the same situation!  I want a DeLorean badly, but don't have 15k
sitting around!  Trust me I checked every pocket of all the pants I own!  

Also, someone said their insurance was $3000!  Is this true with everyone?

About getting an afordable DeLorean:

I saw this movie once (can't remember the name) where this guy wanted a
Lamborgini Countach, but he couldn't afford one.  Since he couldn't afford an
actual Lambo, he bought a copy of one from some corrupt company that
eventually went under and his car died with it.

Anyway, does anyone know if anyone produces a DeLorean Look-a-Like?
 Hopefully one that will last, unlike the Lambo in the movie.

Thanks!

- --Paul

BTW- If anyone could help me get my hands on a DMC grill emblem it would be
very much apreciated(sp?). 

------------------------------

From: Delornut(AT)aol.com
Date: Wed, 28 Feb 1996 20:19:14 -0500
Subject: Re: dmcnews-digest V2 #77

In a message dated 96-02-28 10:48:21 EST, you write:

> 
>



------------------------------

From: Delornut(AT)aol.com
Date: Wed, 28 Feb 1996 20:19:13 -0500
Subject: Re: Super DeLorean

The Delorean someone referred to a while back with the Buick V-6 was built by
Gale Banks for a person who prefers to remain anonymous. The engine is built
up to over 500 hp with twin turbos and a dry sump lubrication system. I've
seen the car on a couple of occasions at The DeLorean Motor Center. Don
Steiger, who owns that shop, did a lot of work on the suspension. He
installed cross drilled brake rotors with aircraft style calipers and braided
brake line hoses. 
Don used to carry bellhousings that mated Buick V-6's and Chevy V-8's to the
Delorean transmission and he may still carry them. Delorean One leans toward
keeping the car original and in concours condition but The Delorean Motor
Center does turbos and has trick components such as the aircraft style
brakes. Needless to say these things come at a cost of many $$'s but if your
leaning in that direction Don is a good guy to talk to. 

DeLornut

------------------------------

From: The Doctor 
Date: Wed, 28 Feb 1996 19:29:04 CST
Subject: Re: Various Mechanical Maladies

I apologize for taking so long to answer...the Rush e-mail system 
requires a physical key - i.e., no remote login.

* Key turns, but car won't start.
1) Faulty ignition switch.  The contacts which activate the starter are 
not making contact.
2) Faulty wiring, especially the segment between the starter 
solenoid/relay and the starter itself.
3) Faulty starter - either internal wiring or the entire blessed starter.
4) Faulty contact within the starter solenoid/relay - especially in light of 
the damp weather your DMC has seen.

Since you say the relay is engaging, option 2 seems the most likely. The 
fact that the car has been out in the rain only makes matters worse.  
But  "charging sound"?  The electrical system can only charge the 
battery when the engine is running.  What is this "charging sound"?

* Creaking/rattling in the front of the car at slow speeds.
1) Imbalanced wheels.
2) Loose suspension.
3) Faulty shock dampers.
4) Weakening frame [the last thing most DMC owners want to hear].

Mix and match any of the above.  Note that creaking due to wheel 
a/o suspension imbalance will be exacerbated at lower speeds due to the 
lower frequency of the vibration at these speeds, which necessarily 
transmits more force into the suspension and chassis.  As the speeds 
increase, the frequency will increase to a level where the vibration will 
simply blend in.  Also, suspension and chassis problems will be more 
noticeable in colder weather, when the metal has less inherent flex.

*Delay Wipers
Could be a problem with either the wiper switch [which, as I recall, was 
broken a week or two ago] or, alternatively, with an overheated delay 
control module.  These modules - even at their best - tend to run hot at 
long delay settings, where they must keep the wipers at station-keeping 
until called for.  If memory serves me, there's a fix for this - does anyone 
recall it?

* Speedometers
As of July 1979, all cars sold in the USA were required by Federal law to 
have a speedometer which highlighted 55 mph and was calibrated only 
to 85 mph.  At the time, the Government powers-that-be thought that 
this change would inspire the populace to observe the national speed 
limit, with the added effect of the smaller range providing a subconcious 
reminder to keep speeds low.  Suprises all around, it never worked as 
planned.  Even before this measure was repealed, automakers had found 
ways around it - both by digital gauges and special analog gauges [e.g. 
the Mustang SVO speedometer, which was numbered up to 85 but which 
continued (without numbers) to 120-130 mph].

* BTTF
1) Hill Valley to the Lone Pine/Twin Pines Mall.  Note that Marty had to 
travel [at a high rate of speed] towards Hill Valley, once he got away from 
the farm in 1955, to reach Lyon Estates.  From there, it was roughly two 
miles to the *outskirts* of Hill Valley [mileage signs rarely give the 
distance to downtown unless specified on the sign].  Thus, it may have 
been three-plus miles from downtown Hill Valley to the Mall - making 
Marty's run there in under ten minutes even more impressive.  Along 
those lines - he should have allotted more than ten minutes to get 
there, especially considering the driveability problems of Doc Brown's 
DeLorean.

2) If Doc Brown was able to improve the performance of the PRV V-6 so 
much, how come he couldn't adjust it [or even *think* of adjusting it] to 
burn alcohol in BTTF3?

3) How could the Doc even get to the engine with all that nuclear 
reactor-cooling tower-hover thruster [2015] garbage on the rear deck?

4) For those of you who think 4-D, remember that even as the gas ran 
out of the 1955-converted DMC in that bear's cave in 1885 [BTTF3], the 
2015-converted [but time-circuit-deprived] DMC sealed up in the 
abandoned mine had a full tank of fairly fresh gas.  If the Doc and Marty 
had any moxie, they would have broken back into the mine and 
siphoned out a few gallons to refuel the 1955-converted DMC once the 
Doc repaired the fuel line.  The DeLorean could easily have been 
refueled [albeit with leaded gas] in 1955 after unearthing it.

5) There are two methods for doing the "bootlegger's turn" previously 
mentioned: 1) with the parking brake, which is very hard on the rear 
wheel assemblies, or 2) by breaking the rear wheels loose with a sudden 
burst of wheelspin - e.g., by downshifting into a lower gear while 
on-throttle - which is visciously hard on the transmission.  If you feel 
inspired to imitate this foolishness, at least do it on a slick surface 
[rain, snow, ice, gravel] as was done in BTTF [where all spins were done 
on rain-slicked pavement].  If this is attempted on dry streets, you will 
probably succeed in rolling your DeLorean, in which case we will have to 
hunt you down and kill you.

And, to keep Swedish Auto happy:
SwedishAutoSwedishAutoSwedishAutoSwedishAutoSwedishAutoSwedish
AutoSwedishAutoSwedishAutoSwedishAutoSwedishAutoSwedishAutoSw
edishAutoSwedishAutoSwedishAutoSwedishAutoSwedishAutoSwedishAu
toSwedishAutoSwedishAutoSwedishAutoSwedishAutoSwedishAutoSwedi
shAutoSwedishAutoSwedishAutoSwedishAutoSwedishAutoSwedishAuto

The Doctor

------------------------------

From: stormrider(AT)socketis.net (Chase Clark)
Date: Wed, 28 Feb 1996 22:28:00 -0600
Subject: Re: Single Key DeLoreans

According to Service Bulletin ST-31-12/81 all DeLoreans used a common key
for the doors, storage compartment and ignition as of VIN 4188. Mine being
one of the first 1,000 produced for sale does has multiple keys instead of
the single key system and it is not a high priority to me to convert the
car over the one key in the immediate future (if ever).

BTW, the Service Bulletins are not always entirely accurate as to when a
change on the production line took place. For example - Bulletin
ST-15-10/81 claims that as of VIN 1201 the five metal wiring harness clips
in the engine compartment were replaced with redesigned vinyl coated type
clips. My DeLorean is VIN 1529 and was produced in May 1981 and does not
have these new clips. A minor point, yes, but a point none the less.

------------------------------

From: stormrider(AT)socketis.net (Chase Clark)
Date: Wed, 28 Feb 1996 13:40:28 -0600
Subject: Another option for worried buyers

MacLeod:

For those wanna-be DeLorean owners who are not mechanically inclined or
lack the time or desire to tweak the many bugs out of a clasic DeLorean,
there are other options. DeLorean Motor Company in Houston, TX and DeLorean
One in L.A. CA (and perhaps others elsewhere) sell used DeLoreans which
they claim to have gone to great lengths to refurbish and make sure
everything is sound mechanically and that all the important updates/recalls
have been performed. I know that at least one of them offers a
six-month/6,000-mile waranty on their cars.

Naturally, there is a little catch. You will end up paying more for one of
these cars. I believe the starting price at DeLorean One is around $27,000
while DMC is closer to $20,000 according to a friend.

I did not learn of this option until after I had already purchased my
DeLorean. Honestly, it wouldn't have changed my decision though to buy the
one I now have.

In comparison, I got mine for the bargain price of $9,000 and have spent
almost $3,000 to date on repairs and stuff. By the time I am finished this
year, I predict I'll have invested about $15,000 in the car, which is what
I expected it would take from the start. I like tweaking with little things
and can perform most of the updates myself. What I don't dare do, I'll let
a DeLorean-qualified mechanic do for me at a later date.

Good luck in your hunt for info and assurances.

~ Chase

------------------------------

From: stormrider(AT)socketis.net (Chase Clark)
Date: Wed, 28 Feb 1996 22:35:14 -0600
Subject: AC Freon Charge

While I was speaking about service bulletins earlier and wishing that the
final cold spell (wishful thinking) would hurry up and leave the Midwest so
that spring could return, another fact from the service bulletins crossed
my mind.

A brief reminder for those planning on having their air conditioners
checked out soon. According to Bulletin ST-29-11/81 the freon charge was
changed to 2.2 pounds from the previous 2.75 pounds and was introduced with
VIN 4080.

"If knocking noises are observed during starting with the air conditioning
on, the new freon charge specification should be used."

Keep this in mind when prepping your car for summer.

~ Chase

------------------------------

From: HAYES  ALEXANDER CRAIG 
Date: Wed, 28 Feb 1996 21:57:44 -0700 (MST)
Subject: New owners, painted cars...

     It's great to see other young DeLorean owners(or soon to be owners)
out there.  I bought my car when I was 17 and I've really enjoyed owning 
it.  Unfortunately, I'm in school in Colorado and I had to leave my car 
at home in Atlanta.  Just a few tips for those of you thinking of buying 
cars soon.  If you want a Stainless car, buy one.  Do not buy a painted 
car with intentions of removing the paint.  My car is red, and it looks 
great, but I am now planning to sell it this summer so that I can get a 
Stainless one.  As someone else on the list mentioned, the steel must be 
sanded smooth and an acid primer must be used in order to get the paint 
to adhere properly.  I have found the car to be quite easy to work on.  
Before purchasing the car I knew very little about working on cars, but 
with the right manuals and a lot of good advice from other owners, I have 
been able to learn quite a bit.  I definitely would not recommend buying 
a basket case, but a car with some minor problems(especially the kind 
that might lower the cost) is worth looking into.  Good luck.
   -Alex Hayes

------------------------------

From: nidadub(AT)pacific.telebyte.net
Date: Wed, 28 Feb 1996 21:54:10 -0800
Subject: Re: Various Mechanical Maladies

On Wed, 28 Feb 1996, The Doctor  wrote:

>* Key turns, but car won't start.
>1) Faulty ignition switch.  The contacts which activate the starter are 
>not making contact.

	I had thought about that as I was doing some experiments with it, 
but when I turn the key, the car acts exactly as it normally does when it's 
starting, only the engine doesn't attempt to turn over.  The clock blanks, 
the gauges and lights blank, and there's a clicking in the fuse box as 
usuall.  I had thought about the starter kill on the alarm system, but both 
wiring and relays for the system are fine.


>3) Faulty starter - either internal wiring or the entire blessed starter.

	Oh, please don't tell me that...hehehe...SIGH

>4) Faulty contact within the starter solenoid/relay - especially in light 
of 
>the damp weather your DMC has seen.

	Don't remind me...But around the time it started acting up, we were 
in the middle of a  dry spell.

>Since you say the relay is engaging, option 2 seems the most likely. The 
>fact that the car has been out in the rain only makes matters worse.  
>But  "charging sound"?  The electrical system can only charge the 
>battery when the engine is running.  What is this "charging sound"?

	I realize that, but there is a charge like sound.  This was true in 
my fiero only not as obvious and apperant.  When the key is turned to the 
"ON" position there is a buzz like an electrical charge with several 
clicking sounds during.  Don't tell me yours doesn't do this...???

>* Creaking/rattling in the front of the car at slow speeds.
>1) Imbalanced wheels.
>2) Loose suspension.
>3) Faulty shock dampers.
>4) Weakening frame [the last thing most DMC owners want to hear].

	hmmm...The "Mechanics" said they didn't hear anything aside from a 
slight noise when the ear was next to the wheel like a bearing was begining 
to go.  I've been debating new front tires and new shocks.
	And you're right.  The last thing I want to hear about is the 
frame!...hehehe

>*Delay Wipers
>Could be a problem with either the wiper switch [which, as I recall, was 
>broken a week or two ago] or, alternatively, with an overheated delay 
>control module.  These modules - even at their best - tend to run hot at 
>long delay settings, where they must keep the wipers at station-keeping 
>until called for.  If memory serves me, there's a fix for this - does 
anyone 
>recall it?

	The problems was positively identified as the relay.  He 
demonstrated that by pressing on the relay at a certain point and pushing 
down the wiper "wand", the wipers worked fine.  Then they went and broke my 
switch by an attempt to seperate it from the turn signal switch.


>4) For those of you who think 4-D, remember that even as the gas ran 
>out of the 1955-converted DMC in that bear's cave in 1885 [BTTF3], the 
>2015-converted [but time-circuit-deprived] DMC sealed up in the 
>abandoned mine had a full tank of fairly fresh gas.  If the Doc and Marty 
>had any moxie, they would have broken back into the mine and 
>siphoned out a few gallons to refuel the 1955-converted DMC once the 
>Doc repaired the fuel line.  The DeLorean could easily have been 
>refueled [albeit with leaded gas] in 1955 after unearthing it.

	The DMC was sealed in the mine with gas in the tank?  Couldn't be!
	Now, exactly WHY did Doc Brown reroute the fuel line through the 
driverside pylon of the DeLorean thereby making it accessable to a stray 
arrow.


>5) There are two methods for doing the "bootlegger's turn" previously 
>mentioned: 1) with the parking brake, which is very hard on the rear 
>wheel assemblies, or 2) by breaking the rear wheels loose with a sudden 
>burst of wheelspin - e.g., by downshifting into a lower gear while 
>on-throttle - which is visciously hard on the transmission.  If you feel 
>inspired to imitate this foolishness, at least do it on a slick surface 
>[rain, snow, ice, gravel] as was done in BTTF [where all spins were done 
>on rain-slicked pavement].  If this is attempted on dry streets, you will 
>probably succeed in rolling your DeLorean, in which case we will have to 
>hunt you down and kill you.


	I personally want to cry when I think of what was done to those 
poor DeLorean's in the movie.  "Things" bolted onto it, sounds dubbed into 
it, smashed into several garbage cans, spinning, twirling, and skidding 
every which way, windows removed.  I heard a rumor that a hood was ripped 
off of one accidently at one time....!!!


------------------------------

From: aerostar(AT)CCIA.CCIA.COM
Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 04:41:37 -0500
Subject: HotWheels/speedometer

HotWheels?
 
This whole thing has got me going. A few weeks ago I went down to the local 
Toys 'R Us to see what I could find. I plowed through the display of 
HotWheels cars to find the TransAm/DMC package. The packages have a way of 
falling off their hooks as you look for packages in the back. No luck.

The store manager told me that they have no way of knowing what is 
available in their inventory beyond what is in each store. They will not 
special order or take rainchecks. They had never heard of what I was 
looking for.

However, he did give me the number for Mattel Consumer Affairs. I called 
them up and told them what I was looking for: a package specifically made 
for Toys 'R Us that included a DMC along with a TransAm. They did not have 
anything like this in their database since it would be a special order from 
a retailer. I asked if there was ever _any_ DMC made some time in the past 
that while discontinued, might show up in a special package like has been 
mentioned here in DMC News.						
									 
The person I spoke to consulted a HotWheels expert, who could not remember 
any DMC ever manufactured. They mailed me a complete listing of every 
HotWheels ever made, going back to 1968. And what a list it is; did you 
know that there was a Chevy Citation (#3362) issued in 1981? Funny thing 
though, there is no DeLorean, DMC-12, BTTF, nothing at all. Are you guys 
sure it was HotWheels?

Speedometer past 85?

At some point the US Government thought that any speedometer going past 
85MPH was just too dangerous, never mind what the car would do. The DMC, 
like all other sports cars sold in the early 1980's, was restricted to a 
85MPH speedometer. However, Ford found a neat way of getting around this 
stupidity. The speedometer in my '85 Thunderbird Turbo Coupe went up to 
something like 120MPH in marked increments, but the _numbers_ ended at 
85MPH. Haw,haw,haw, take that Uncle Sam! 

BTW, my T-Bird, like all my cars, was silver in color.

Eric Friedebach
PO Box 64
Monaca, PA 15061
aerostar(AT)ccia.com

------------------------------

From: James Espey 
Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 06:57:47 -0700
Subject: Wiper problem

>When in the delay mode my wipers operate fine.  However, when I turn them off
>they sometimes continue to operate as if they were still in delay.  Running
>them at a higher speed sometimes corrects the problem.    Ideas?

My wipers did something similar, and I eventaully figured out that it was 
just a severe case of operator (me) malfunction and IMO, a pretty piss 
poor design by DMC.

The owners manual (http://www.goodnet.com/~mikasa/ownmanu.pdf or on AOL, 
do a software search on "DeLorean") says:

>For a single wipe, press down lever momentarily. For delayed wipe, press 
lever down for
>about three seconds before releasing.

How are you turning them "off"? When mine are on delay, I have to turn 
them to "1" the normal speed setting and then CAREFULLY turn it back down 
to the "resting" position. Sometimes I will accidentally go too far down, 
ending up in delay mode again.

Might not be your problem, but I was causing mine. The fact that it only 
rains about 12 days a year out here didn't help either as my "wiper 
experience" was limited...

James "Mikasa" Espey 
"There is nothing more sad or glorious than generations changing hands..." 

------------------------------

From: stormrider(AT)socketis.net (Chase Clark)
Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 12:34:56 -0600
Subject: DeLorean Photo Posted in Newsgroup

I have figured out how to send the JPEG image of my 1981 DeLorean VIN 1529
across the world via the Internet now. I just posted it to the Newsgroup
"alt.binaries.pictures.vehicles" and was able to retrieve it and view it.
By the time everyone reas this, there should be two images - one from an
agle in front of the car with the doors raised and another from the side
with the doors closed.

Everyone is invited to take a peek at my red DeLorean. But keep in mind
that if anyone has the nerve to call it a "mutt" or a "mongrel" that I
would take it as a personal insult. When I purchased th car it was already
painted red with the custom chrome wheels and rear spoiler. I think it
looks great this way, but I also appreciate the still stainless DeLoreans
and plan to buy a more original version in the coming years.

I can also send it via email if anyone would like. But bear in mind that
these files are about 200K and therefore take quite a few email messages to
transmit.

Happy viewing!

~ Chase

------------------------------

End of dmcnews-digest V2 #80
****************************

Go to previous digest | Go to next digest.

Back to DeLorean Mailing List Page.
Return to Back Issues page.

Having problems with these pages? Have a good idea for the back Issues? Email me at: backissues(AT)dmcnews.com

LinkExchange
Member of the LinkExchange