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Saturday, 28 September 1996 Volume 02 : Number 177
In this issue:
re:Re: Oil Pressure - DANGER
The New DeLorean
The Simpsons DMC
Re: The New DeLorean
Oil Pressure
Re: '82 idle
Re: The New DeLorean
Re: '82 idle
Re: New DeLorean / windshiled / oil pressure / idle
DMC heart transplant, engine arrives
Oil Pressure..
Re: Gas Filler Door
Re: Gas Filler Door
Re: Gas Filler Door
Fuel Flap history / lowering
Re: Gas Filler Door
DMC12 Detail Changes
Re: Gas Filler Door
Re: Gas Filler Door
My Concours Results
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Cadet Jeff Phillips, x4300"
Date: Thu, 26 Sep 96 22:23:24 MDT
Subject: re:Re: Oil Pressure - DANGER
I don't know how much you know about car mechanics but it
seems unlikely that a blown head gasket would gouge you engine at all,
let alone to the point where youd need a new block. Afterall most head
gaskets are made of a metallic material which would not be strong
enough to gouge a cast iron block. Assuming it did, you should be able
to mill the block to fix it. It's really a mute point but what you described
seems impossible.. maybe I'm not understanding what you're
describing. For curiosity sake could you please elaborate on this?
Jeff Phillips
------------------------------
From: Scott Tester
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 1996 04:55:22 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: The New DeLorean
Last week I called John DeLorean and talked to him briefly. I got
very nervous and lost my train of thought, but he probably realized that.
It was a very interesting conversation, The main subject I found interesting
was his new car. He said that the new "DeLorean" car was coming along
very well. If it is released I will definately purchase one. I wonder
if it will decrease the value of the current DeLorean? I also
wonder if John DeLorean has a subscription to this list.
Scott Tester testersd(AT)appstate.campus.mci.net
------------------------------
From: Scott Tester
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 1996 05:00:00 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: The Simpsons DMC
Does anyone know where I could purchase the Simpson's
Episode -3F15 A Fish Called Selma?
This episode has Troy McClure driving a DeLorean in many scenes!
Thanks!
Scott Tester testersd(AT)appstate.campus.mci.net
------------------------------
From: "Mr. THX"
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 1996 08:06:13 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: The New DeLorean
Boing!
NEW DeLorean? Why is it that nobody here or in DeLorean World
reported this? Anyone see a mention of this in Car & Driver or Motor
Trend? I'd like to know more about it!
Mike
------------------------------
From: "Don Gowler-CFPO01"
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 1996 8:24:00 -0500
Subject: Oil Pressure
- -C2 wrote
"This oil pressure conversation has gone on quite a few
times since the initiation of this group. One of us
somewhere has to have some advancing insight into what's
going on. Obviously it is a widespread problem. I'm
sure someone other than me believes this isn't acceptable.
As well, I plan to do my part in researching this matter.
I mean, come on, I can't possibly be just "70 dollars"
away from the answer."
So has anyone talked to Don Steger, Stephen Wynn, Rob Grady, John Truscott or Ed
Bernstein about this issue. Surely their collective experience can shed some
professional 'insight' into this matter. Are they on this list?
Regards, The Silver Fox
------------------------------
From: "Mr. THX"
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 1996 10:07:50 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: '82 idle
Hi all,
James said that his '82 runs at an idle speed of 1100 RPM with the
AC off. My '82 runs at 750 RPM with the AC off. James, is this something
you should look into?
Mike
------------------------------
From: James Espey
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 96 07:28:09 -0800
Subject: Re: The New DeLorean
>The main subject I found interesting
>was his new car. He said that the new "DeLorean" car was coming along
>very well. If it is released I will definately purchase one. I wonder
If JZD ever produces another car, in more than prototype quantities, or
even more than some comceptual drawings, I'll pierce my tongue. Mark my
words, as much as I would like to be wrong, it'll never happen.
>if it will decrease the value of the current DeLorean? I also
Interesting point (though I doubt it'll ever become more than a
theoretical question), I would think that the value of good, clea,
original cars would go up.
>wonder if John DeLorean has a subscription to this list.
Though some former DMC employees are on the list, I do not believe that
JZD is one of them. I have been told indirectly that he occasionally
receives copies of the list, I do not know for a fact that he does or
from what source.
James
------------------------------
From: James Espey
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 96 07:35:48 -0800
Subject: Re: '82 idle
> James said that his '82 runs at an idle speed of 1100 RPM with the
>AC off. My '82 runs at 750 RPM with the AC off. James, is this something
>you should look into?
I think so. According to "the books" idle speed is electronically
controlled to 775 +/- 50 rpm. Therefore mine is not right. I have been
hesitant to buy a new idle speed control unit (at $300), but it has yet
to effect me passing emissions, so for me right now at least, it falls
into the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" category.
However, I am open to suggestions...
James
------------------------------
From: Mike Substelny
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 1996 10:47:21 -0400
Subject: Re: New DeLorean / windshiled / oil pressure / idle
Scott Tester said:
>Last week I called John DeLorean He said that the
>new "DeLorean" car was coming along very well. I
>wonder if it will decrease the value of the current
>DeLorean?
I doubt it, Scott. What could the new car do to harm the
old? When the "new" Stutzs and Duesenbergs came out in
the 1970s they caused *increased* interest in the originals.
Mike (Mr. THX) said:
>NEW DeLorean? Why is it that nobody here or in DeLorean
>World reported this?
Good question! One of the most important factors in
launching a new automobile is getting the public excited
about it.
John Z. DeLorean, if you are lurking out there, I hope you see
this message and send out a press release or something. I
suggest that an Internet home page would be an inexpensive
way to get the world excited about the new DeLorean. Good
luck with your new car. I love ya, man!
James wrote:
>If JZD ever produces another car, in more than prototype
>quantities, or even more than some comceptual drawings,
>I'll pierce my tongue.
Ha ha ha. What do you know that we don't, James?
Chase wrote:
>My windshield was hit by a rock while driving down the
>highway It's not like my car is anywhere near
>original, but I love the windshield antenna tape.
I absolutely agree, Chase. I am in the same situation as
you: an early '81 with a broken windshield. I have been
looking for over a year, and the taped windshields are quite
rare. As I understand it, many of the '81s that once had the
tape antenna later had them refitted with masts, so a lot of
the taped windshields were probably destroyed.
I got a Kapac windshield last year, but I have not installed it
because I have no good alternative for the antenna. I love the
lines of the car and I require that my antenna must not
protrude at all. Actually, I am glad I didn't install the
windshield. The old one took a few stones this summer, and
if that had happened to the new one I would be heart broken.
There were non-DeLorean cars that used an antenna tape
(Chevys, Chryslers etc. as I recall). A car audio guy told me
to go to one of their dealerships and I could find a tape-on
unit. Unfortunately, to make it look original I must drill a hole
through my new glass (for the bolt in the corner). I am not
ready for that!
Don Gowler said (about oil pressure):
> So has anyone talked to Don Steger, Stephen Wynn,
>Rob Grady, John Truscott or Ed Bernstein about this
>issue.
Back when I was first shopping for my DeLorean I noticed
that the oil pressure gauges in all the cars I test drove read
near the top. I called John Truscott and he said that this was
normal.
If Don, Stephen, Rob, John or Ed are lurking out there please
notice that people still want an expert's opinion. They won't
take *my* word for it, no matter how brilliant I am.
James said:
>My car idles about 1100 WITHOUT the A/C on, and around
>900 WITH the A/C on. I understand that the idle is
>NOT adjustable, and an Idle Speed Control Unit runs a
>couple hundred bucks. Mike, please, elaborate on this
>"easy to repair" problem.
I don't have my manual in front of me, but I think it specifies a
warm idle somewhere around 800 rpm (a/c off). I can't read
my tach that accurately, so I'm happy with anything below
1,000. My car *definitely* passes emission tests when idling
anywhere below 1,000 and fails when idling somewhere
above 1,000.
As I said yesterday, I haven't repaired mine yet. A mechanic
told me it would be easy. Often in the past I have not agreed
with his idea of "easy!" He mentioned the Idle Speed Control
Unit, but he didn't say what to do.
My theory was always that my 15 year old throttle cable just
needs some lubrication, and that may still be all there is to
it. Before my second emission test I gave my gas pedal a
"kick" to make sure the throttle wasn't stuck. This sent the
idle below 1,000 rpm. Then my car passed the test with
almost zero emissions.
- -Mike Substelny
------------------------------
From: Knut S Grimsrud
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 96 08:58:00 PDT
Subject: DMC heart transplant, engine arrives
For those following the story....
My new engine arrived a couple days ago and I went to the shop last
night to take a look at it all. When I get photos developed I may post
them. The engine took just over one week to arrive via truck freight
from KAPAC.
The engine was everything it was advertized to be (although it does
NOT include the air cleaner but DOES include _everything_ else). The
engine was a bit dusty from storage over the last 12-15 years, but it
was immaculate in every other way. A little grime will quickly be
blown away with the first steam-clean. Althouygh I didn;t check, I was
told that the alternator included with the engine is the Ducellier, so
I will transplant my Motorola alternator from my old engine.
The engine was crated properly for shipping and the A/C compressor,
alternator, and starter had been removed and packaged separately (but
in the same crate) for shipment. The flywheel showed some minor
rusting that would easily be brushed off with a Scotch-Brite pad, and
the exhaust manifolds (which are soft cast iron) were already rusted.
Rusting of the exhaust manifolds is normal and unavoidable (check
yours out sometime). Does anyone have suggestions for making the
exhaust manifolds look nice?
My old engine had already been removed and the engine compartment was
in the process of being cleaned up. With the engine out, it is a good
opportunity to take care of any frame touch-up in the engine
compartment. I am having all the loose epoxy scraped, sanded and
re-finished before putting the new engine back in. My car looked
pretty sad with the engine compartment gutted and the rear fascia and
fiberglass sections removed for engine access.
Incidentally, the rear section of the car easily comes off to give you
better access to the egine compartment for larger jobs. The next time
you shear a bolt off on your water pump, you might consider just
taking the back of the car off to gain better access.
I will be taking my old engine home after they are sure they will not
need any pieces off it (after examining the new engine, I cann't
imagine they will need ANYTHING off the old one with the exception of
the Motorola alternator) and re-building it from ground up. While I'm
going to the trouble I will replace all the worn components with
higher-performance equivalents and eventually have a better-than-new
replacement engine handy. Does anybody have a DeLorean with missing
engine they want to sell me?
Knut Grimsrud
DOA Chapter 41
------------------------------
From: malevy(AT)lucent.com
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 1996 13:51:58 +0100
Subject: Oil Pressure..
My 81 oil pressure changes with the temperature... This makes sense.
When comparing how your gage looks as compared to someone else's, you may
want to consider the oil weight and temperature.
When I first got the car 4 years ago, It had 20W-50 in it, and it was
early fall. The oil pressure gage was always on the high side at idle,
and pegged with any increase in RPM.
I switched to Synthetic 5W-50, and now as the car warms up, the pressure
drops a bit. Under high RPM the needle is just hangin below 80. When
the car is cold, it is pegged at 80.
Just my .02
Marc
malevy(AT)lucent.com
------------------------------
From: DMC81sle(AT)aol.com
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 1996 17:15:09 -0400
Subject: Re: Gas Filler Door
I own an '81 Delorean which has a fuel filler access door built into the
luggage compartment cover (hood). I thought this to be a standard DMC
feature. Yesterday I received my first issue of DeLorean World (Yes !!!!!!!)
and I can't see such a door on any of the photos depicting front views.
Anyone know the story on this ? Thanks for any info.
------------------------------
From: James Espey
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 96 18:08:19 -0800
Subject: Re: Gas Filler Door
>I own an '81 Delorean which has a fuel filler access door built into the
>luggage compartment cover (hood). I thought this to be a standard DMC
>feature. Yesterday I received my first issue of DeLorean World (Yes !!!!!!!)
>and I can't see such a door on any of the photos depicting front views.
>Anyone know the story on this ? Thanks for any info.
The story I always heard was the design was changed towards the end of
the 81 model year (anyone know the exact VIN? My parts manual just says
"bulletin to follow") to keep people from spilling gas all over the
hoods. Now you get to spill it on your luggage instead. Makes a lot more
sense to me. Late '81 hoods had the "design lines" in the hood but no
flap, '82 and '83 hoods were just flat with no flap. Debate continues on
whethere the "delorean" script on the hood was on all or some of the '82s
and '83s. For the record, my '82 (#10570) has the script.
James
------------------------------
From: Henry Breer
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 1996 18:31:52 -0700
Subject: Re: Gas Filler Door
DMC81sle(AT)aol.com wrote:
>
> I own an '81 Delorean which has a fuel filler access door built into the
> luggage compartment cover (hood). I thought this to be a standard DMC
> feature. Yesterday I received my first issue of DeLorean World (Yes !!!!!!!)
> and I can't see such a door on any of the photos depicting front views.
> Anyone know the story on this ? Thanks for any info.
Scott,
There were three different hoods on DeLoreans. They roughly align with
the 'model years' '81, 82, & '83.
The '81 hood has the door (referred to as a Fuel Flap Assembly in the
DeLorean Parts Book). The '82 hood lost the door, but retained the two
indentations running from front to back. The '83 Hood was totally flat,
no door, no indentations. I believe that all the hoods that are
available from KPAC are also of this type.
This is the 'quick' way if distinguishing between years - unless you find
a car like mine which is an '81 (VIN 1141) but had been crashed before I
bought it and repaired with a flat hood.
Hank Breer
------------------------------
From: SCiszek(AT)aol.com
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 1996 21:37:54 -0400
Subject: Fuel Flap history / lowering
A while (long while) back there was some discussion of what the reasons
were behind the removal of the fuel filler flap found on early 81's from
subsequent cars. I recall a story I heard a while back wile conversing with a
fellow DeLorean owner in my area. He said that the reason for omitting this
feature from later cars was that the placement of the flap created a major
structural weakpoint in the hood. Apparently much stress was placed on the
lower left hand corner of the flap intrusion which caused the hood to
sometimes warp, and most notably, to rattle at high speeds ( my fellow owner
was quick to point out that he had 1st hand experience in this area ).
Sounds good to me.
Also, I am looking for a good source for springs with which to lower my
car. Does anyone know which DeLorean shops stock this product. Exactly what
is involved in the lowering process, ie: can it be done in the comfort of
your own garage or must you take it to a shop? Is there anything else that
needs to be adjusted after lowering ( steering coloumn, etc)? Thank you.
- Scott Ciszek
------------------------------
From: James Espey
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 96 18:43:16 -0800
Subject: Re: Gas Filler Door
>DeLorean Parts Book). The '82 hood lost the door, but retained the two
>indentations running from front to back.
Screech! Stop! Rewind! Try again! Let's take an impromptu survey of '82
owners - Does ANY owner of a 1982 "D" (with the original hood) have these
indentations? I'll start the survery responses by saying that mine does
not. Anyone else?
James
------------------------------
From: Henry Breer
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 1996 18:43:56 -0700
Subject: DMC12 Detail Changes
Reading Scott's question about the fuel door brought to mind a question
that I have about the rear louvres.
My '81 (#1141) has only a narrow (1/8") vane in the center, separating
and supporting the louvres. Most of the cars I have seen at DOA events
have a much wider (say 3/4") support at the rear end of the vane. Does
anyone know the VIN number that corresponds to this change?
Hank Breer
------------------------------
From: "Mr. THX"
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 1996 22:26:50 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: Gas Filler Door
James,
Chalk me up for an '82 owner 10213 Dec. 81 who has NO door, but
retains that lining.
Mike
------------------------------
From: franka(AT)midwest.net (Frank Augustine)
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 1996 21:37:12 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: Re: Gas Filler Door
>>DeLorean Parts Book). The '82 hood lost the door, but retained the two
>>indentations running from front to back.
>
>Screech! Stop! Rewind! Try again! Let's take an impromptu survey of '82
>owners - Does ANY owner of a 1982 "D" (with the original hood) have these
>indentations? I'll start the survery responses by saying that mine does
>not. Anyone else?
>
My DeLorean is an '81 .. vin# 4181 and it DOES NOT have any indentations ..
it's smooooooth
Frank
Frank of FOTOZ Color Lab
Centralia, Illinois, USA
------------------------------
From: James Espey
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 96 21:24:57 -0700
Subject: My Concours Results
Well, I got my judging sheets back earlier this week, and I'm pretty
pleased with the results. To recap, there were 8 cars in the concours,
1st place was trailered in from TX, second (I believe) was driven from
Ohio and 3rd was also driven (I think) from Kentucky. At the Awards
dinner, it was announced that 20 points separated the three top
finishers. Let's assume that the first place car was perfect at 300
points, and the third place finisher was at 280. I scored 258 points,
which I was pleased with. When I judged myc ar myself, I was a harsher on
myself, though. In any case, I think the judging was very thorough, and
also very fair. Here is the breakdown of how I fared:
Special Items: 42 out of 45
-1 for non-working defog switch
-1 for no seat belt buzzer
-1 for door buzzer
Interior: 43 out of 51
-1 for worn passenger seat
-2 for worn driver seat
-1 for a mark on the console
-1 for a split plastic lens on the radio LED display
-1 for discolored dash and binnacle
-2 for worn carpet
Luggage compartment 13 out of 19
-2 for having a CD changer
-1 for worn carpet
-1 for scratches in the paint of the side panels
-.5 for a dirty spare tire
-.5 for a dirt inside the jack storage compartment
-.5 for worn carpet on underside on deck lid
-.5 for cracked seals on underside of deck lid
Engine and compartment: 42 out of 53
-1 for car alarm siren
-1 slight corrosion on some unpainted nuts, bolts and washers
-1 for wrong year on emissions sticker
-2 for aftermarket exhaust bracket
-2 for slight rust on hinges of engine cover and broken sliding block
-1 for incorrect RH water pump hose
-1 for metal header bottle
-1 for wrong brand of battery
-1 partially missing battery hold down strap
Undercarriage: 28 out of 28
PERFECT SCORE
Exterior: 77 out of 89
-2 for overall body quality
-2 for minor dent in left rear quarter (noticed in spite of Chris
Rabalais trying to stand in front of it!)
-1 slight nick in windshield glass
-2 scratch on right side power window glass
-1 power window trim damaged (from previous break-in attempt)
-3 for "raised eyebrows) over headlights on fascia
-1 for misadjusted rear louver
Attention to detail: 13 out of 15
-2 for damaged inner door moldings
Well, I **was** pretty pleased until I typed it all out. Sounds like my
car is a pig, huh? I am tentatively planning to attend the concours in
Aspen next fall, and I think most of these items are at the "easy to
remedy" end of the scale. 24 hours before the concours, this car had six
states worth of bugs, road tar and oil on it. Without the help of Chris
Rabalais and another DeLorean-freak (who has requested anonymity), I
wouldn't have done as well as I did. If you'd like more information, feel
free to email me. The concours rules and judging guidelines (in PDF
format) are on the DOA home page at "http://www.delorean-owners.org".
James
------------------------------
End of dmcnews-digest V2 #177
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